Please tell me more about BF insulation.

stevek · Post by **stevek** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:03 am

I looking to buy. My first RV ever.
Looking at a 2010 and a 2011. Both 22 foot.
And almost ready to buy.

How much and what type of insulation do they have?
Read somewhere 1/4" foilbacked. If this is true, seems thin.

How is the interior constructed/ and whats inside..wood studs? .. to attach the interior wall to the exterior fiberglass shell?

Thanks... Steve

jeffcarp · Post by **jeffcarp** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 6:00 pm

We own a 22' 2011 model and while I can't tell you the construction details of the walls, I can tell you the results of it. We had our coach down in the Branson / Table Rock Lake area last week when it hit 100 degrees outside. We were able to keep the interior of the coach (while parked and not camping) at the same as the outside temperature by using the roof exhaust fan. When running the coach air conditioner, I was able to get it down into the low 80's within about 45 minutes and while driving in that heat on the freeway with only the dash AC the family behind me asked me to turn the fan down and they put blankets on their legs.

I went from a class B to this coach and I can tell you that it is a day and night difference in insulation. But, as I said, I cannot tell you what the R-value is to compare to other manufacturers.

al1florida · Post by **al1florida** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:53 pm

Insulation:
This is what is in my 2005 26RSB

No floor insulation. It is good solid 3/4" plywood backed with fiberglass glued or laminated to the plywood.

Much or all of the roof is good solid 3/4" plywood with the same fiberglass as the floor. There is about 1/4" of cloth or carpet type material and foil between the cloth and the plywood on the inside.

What I have seen of the sides is wood framing with fiberglass batting between the inside wood/cloth and the molded fiberglass. I don't know how much plywood is on the sides.

Bottom line, NOT much insulation.

We are going to find out this fall just how hard or easy it will be to keep warm in 20-30 degree nights/mornings with a catalytic heater while boondocking.

If you plan on using the BF in freezing weather be aware the black and gray water tanks and the plumbing is exposed to the freezing temps.

shilohdad · Post by **shilohdad** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:03 am

I can't tell you what the nature of the insulation is, but I can tell you of our experience of camping in cold weather. We have camped in temperatures as cold as 17 degrees with no problems.

We do put Reflectix insulation sheets over the windows when it gets this cold. This material is similar to the reflecting windshield sunscreens one can buy, but thicker with honeycomb cells between the two reflecting surfaces. You can buy this in rolls and cut pieces to the appropriate size for the windows. The window shades/blinds keep them in place over the windows.

Using the Reflectix and a 1500 watt electric heater, we easily keep the interior of the coach at 55 degrees, the temperature in which we like to sleep. I might be able to keep the coach a little warmer than that with outside temperatures at 17, but it would be a stretch for the electric heater to do that. The furnace can definitely keep the coach at 70, as we have done that in cold weather.

In weather as cold as 17, the main concern is keeping the fresh water system operational. We keep the hot water heater on in that case, and open the cabinet doors wherever there are fresh water lines/tank to keep them from freezing. As mentioned by another poster, this does not help with the waste tanks, as they are outside exposed to the cold weather. We have never camped when the daytime temperature did not go above freezing, so we have never had the problem of being unable to dump the waste tanks.

So, while you do have to take precautions for using the Born Free in cold weather, it is certainly doable.

William Higbie · Post by **William Higbie** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:12 am

I believe you can keep the waste tanks from freezing by pouring some anti freeze down the toilet and into a sink drain and then turning on the sink for a few seconds. You can use common windshield washer solution as a anti freeze. Of course I dont believe it would be practical to try and keep them from freezing in prolonged severe cold.

whemme · Post by **whemme** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:05 am

Of course you don't want to use automotive antifreeze because it is toxic and illegal to dump into any sewer drain system. The use of pink RV antifreeze or windshield washer fluid is also problematic because of the quantity that would be required. In order to provide reasonable protection down to say 0 degrees F, you would need to have probably around a 50% solution of pink RV antifreeze in the gray and black water tanks. If the tanks in question had a 25 gallon capacity, you would need 12.5 gallons of pink RV antifreeze in each tank if you allowed the two tanks to become filled in cold weather. 25 gallons of pink antifreeze would cost about $100. Another problem is that your tank holding capacity is cut in half and besides where would you store 25 gallons of antifreeze in your coach?

stevek · Post by **stevek** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 11:15 am

I called BF and talked to Ed.
Walls have R value of approx. 18.
I may not have this construction 100% correct, but this from my notes:

3/16" fiberglass ext.

Vapor barrier... foil faces inside of fiberglass.
Has air bubbles, white plastic on other face.

Wood stud walls.. 2x4 laid flat or 2x2 glued to inside of fiberglass.
So void is about 1 1/2"

Spun fiberglass in this 1 1/2" void.

Thin Luan plywood. Maybe not 100% everywhere?

Then finally the foamed backed "carpet".
Starting in 2013, will be foamed backed "leather".

Forgot to ask him about floors and tanks... but should of.

al1florida · Post by **al1florida** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:08 pm

We use our BF in the fall/winter/spring so I enclosed my holding tanks. It took me about 3 weeks of steady work. I used 3/4" pressure treated plywood with 3/4" thick pink Owens Corning foamular insulation (purchased at Home Depot or Lowes). I also added forced air ventilation to the enclosure. I installed two 12V computer muffin fans to blow air from inside the coach into the enclosure and exiting to the outside. If the temps get too cold I can turn the fans on. This also helps ventilate the interior of the coach when we use the catalytic heater.

I would not do this on a standard BF, I have a 6" lift due to the installation of 4x4. The enclosure did lower the clearance below the tanks by about 2 1/2 to 3 inches.